With Doug Aamoth and Paul Ducklin.
DOUG. Uber hacked, extra on the LastPass breach, and Firefox 105.
All that, and extra, on the Bare Safety Podcast.
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Welcome to the podcast, all people, I’m Doug Aamoth.
With me, as all the time, is Paul Ducklin…
[DRAMATIC VOICE] …the host of Safety SOS Week, a star-studded lineup of interviews with safety consultants operating from 26-29 September 2022.
DUCK. I just like the sound of that, Doug. [LAUGHS]
DOUG. Sure!
DUCK. Please be a part of us subsequent week, people.
It’s the final week of September.
We selected that as a result of it’s the week main as much as Cybersecurity Consciousness Month – that’s not a coincidence.
So, 26, 27, 28, and 29 September 2022.
Every day there’s a 30-minute interview with one in every of 4 totally different consultants at Sophos.
We’ve bought Fraser Howard, malware skilled extraordinaire.
We’ve bought Greg Rosenberg, who will clarify the challenges of detecting that somebody is in your community to start out with, so you possibly can head them off earlier than it goes incorrect.
There’s Peter Mackenzie from our Incident Response Staff, who will inform you some fascinating, scary, however very academic tales about attackers that he’s been despatched into bat in opposition to.
And we wrap all of it up with Craig Jones, who will inform you learn how to arrange a SecOps group of your personal.
Craig is the Senior Director of Safety Operations *at Sophos itself*, Doug, so he does cybersecurity in a cybersecurity firm.
He’s a beautiful chap, and properly price listening to.
The URL is: https://sophos.com/sosweek
DOUG. Can’t wait… I might be there!
Please be a part of me, everybody – it will likely be a rollicking good time.
And talking of a rollicking good time, it’s time for our This Week in Tech Historical past phase.
One thing that’s close to and expensive to my coronary heart – this week, on 23 September 2008, the world’s first Android telephone was launched.
It was referred to as the T-Cell G1, and it featured a 3.2-inch flip-out display screen that exposed a full {hardware} keyboard.
It additionally had a trackball and no normal headphone jack.
Early opinions have been blended, however hopeful.
Because of Android’s comparatively open nature, G1 went on to promote 1,000,000 handsets in six months, and at one level accounted for two-thirds of units on T-Cell’s 3G community.
I had a kind of units… it was one in every of my favourite telephones of all time.
DUCK. Aaaaah, trackballs on telephones, eh?
Bear in mind the BlackBerries?
It was the factor, wasn’t it… that trackball was actually nice.
DOUG. It was good for scrolling.
DUCK. Then they went, “Out with transferring components,” and it was an infrared sensor or one thing.
DOUG. Sure.
DUCK. How instances change, Doug.
DOUG. Sure… I miss it.
DUCK. Such as you, I favored these slide-out keyboards that the early telephones had.
There’s one thing reassuring about really listening to the click-click-click.
I believe what I actually favored about it’s that while you popped out the keyboard, it didn’t obscure half the display screen.
DOUG. Precisely!
DUCK. It wasn’t like half the e-mail you’re studying disappeared while you needed to answer.
Which I assume we’ve simply bought used to now… that’s the best way of the world, I suppose.
DOUG. That was a very long time in the past – easier instances.
Let’s discuss in regards to the Firefox 105 launch.
What’s new from a safety standpoint right here, Paul?
DUCK. Fortuitously, nothing that seems to be within the wild and nothing that charges a crucial stage of vulnerability.
However there are a number of intriguing vulnerabilities.
One by which a person net web page that’s cut up right into a bunch of separate IFRAMES might have safety permission leakage between these elements.
So, you might need a less-privileged body from a subdomain in your web site, for instance, that isn’t supposed to have the ability to entry the webcam (as a result of this bug is about machine permissions), but it appears to be like as if you may really have the opportunity to take action.
And one other comparable sounding bug, the place a subdomain of your web site – a weblog or a microsite or one thing like that – might really mess with cookies within the mother or father web site.
Oh, and a superb previous “stack buffer overflow when initialising graphics”… only a reminder that reminiscence bugs are nonetheless an issue!
And naturally, there’s the standard “reminiscence security bugs fastened in Firefox 105”, and within the Prolonged Help Launch, which is 102.3.
Keep in mind that within the Prolonged Help Launch, the 2 numbers add collectively: 102+3 = 105.
So, the Prolonged Help Launch is all the things from the principle model quantity, plus three updates price of safety fixes, however with the function fixes held again.
So get it whereas it’s contemporary.
DOUG. Please do!
Let’s transfer on to the story of the century, breathlessly reported: “Uber has been hacked.”
Wanting just a little nearer at it… sure, it’s unhealthy, it’s embarrassing, nevertheless it might have been a lot, a lot worse.
DUCK. Sure, Uber has come out with a comply with up report, and plainly they’re suggesting {that a} hacking group like LAPSUS$ was accountable.
We’ve spoken about LAPSUS$ on the podcast earlier than.
It’s a type of a “let’s do it for the lulz” form of factor, the place it doesn’t look as if they’re really after promoting the information, though they may give it away totally free or actually embarrass the corporate with it.
As I say, the embarrassment comes from the obvious extent of the breach, happily, somewhat than its depth.
It looks like the attackers needed to wander round by way of the community as shortly as potential, grabbing screenshots, saying, “Hey, look, right here’s me in all types of issues”…
…together with Slack workspaces; Uber’s menace safety software program (in previous language, the anti-virus); an AWS console; firm journey and bills.
There was a screenshot that I noticed revealed that confirmed who’d put within the greatest T&E [travel and expenses] claims in current instances. [LAUGHTER]
We snicker, however there are worker names in there, in order that’s a foul look as a result of it’s implying that the particular person might have gotten at worker information.
A vSphere digital server console; Google workspaces; and the place the place it appears the hacker really put within the “UBER HAS BEEN HACKED” in capital letters that made the headlines (it even made the Bare Safety headline).
Apparently that was posted to… (oh, expensive, Doug [LAUGHS] – it’s not humorous, but it’s)
…to Uber’s personal bug bounty service, which is a really embarrassing look.
DOUG. It appears like somebody bought a maintain of an Uber polo shirt and put it on, and sweet-talked their well beyond the reception desk saying, “Oh, my badge isn’t working,” or one thing, bought into the headquarters after which simply began taking photos of stuff.
Then they wrote on the bulletin board within the worker break room that they’ve been hacked.
It appears like this particular person might have been an Preliminary Entry Dealer [jargon term for hacker who steals passwords and sells them on] in the event that they actually needed to.
They may have completed so many further unhealthy issues whereas they have been in there.
However they only took photos, and it was a humiliation to Uber.
DUCK. Sure.
I believe the important thing element that we might add to your analogy of “getting by way of the principle safety checkpoint” is that, on the best way in, it additionally appears that they have been capable of attain into the super-secure secret cupboard the place the access-all-areas passes are saved, and purloin one.
DOUG. Sure. [LAUGHS]
DUCK. In different phrases, they discovered a password in a PowerShell script, on an overtly seen community share…
…so that they solely wanted low stage entry, and that allowed them to get into what was primarily the password supervisor for Uber’s networks.
DOUG. Sure.
So it’s not that this wasn’t unavoidable.
If we get to the recommendation in your article right here, we now have a number of issues that Uber might have completed in another way.
Beginning with: “Password managers and two-factor authentication will not be a panacea.”
Simply because you’ve got these… that’s a safety gate, nevertheless it’s not the end-all and be-all to maintaining somebody out.
DUCK. Completely.
We’ll be speaking in regards to the LastPass breach in a minute, the place plainly the attackers didn’t really must trouble with the 2FA aspect of issues.
They simply waited till the consumer that they have been shadowing had gone by way of that train themselves, after which “borrowed their move”.
So, certainly, 2FA doesn’t imply, “Oh, now I don’t have to fret about outsiders getting in.”
It does make that preliminary entry a bit more durable, and should make the social engineering extra difficult and extra more likely to stand out.
However as you say, it’s an extra safety gate.
DOUG. And the subsequent one, on the identical be aware, is: “When you’re in, you possibly can’t simply let folks wander round.”
Safety belongs in every single place within the community, not simply on the edge.
DUCK. Do I hear you saying the phrases Zero Belief, Douglas?
DOUG. [LAUGHS] I used to be going to…
DUCK. I do know that feels like a little bit of a gross sales schpiel, and (shock, shock) Sophos has a Zero Belief Community Entry product.
However we now have that product as a result of I believe it’s one thing that’s demanded by the best way that fashionable networks function, so that you just solely get the entry you really want for the duty in hand.
And, if you consider it, that doesn’t simply profit the corporate that’s dividing up its community.
It’s additionally good for customers, as a result of it means they will’t make unlucky blunders despite the fact that they assume they’re attempting to do the fitting factor.
DOUG. And we additionally discuss: “Common cybersecurity measurement and testing”.
In case you’re not in a position to try this in-house, contemplate hiring it out, since you want eyes on this across the clock.
DUCK. Sure.
Two cliches, if I could, Doug?
DOUG. You could. [LAUGHS]
DUCK. Cybersecurity is a journey, not a vacation spot.
You regularly should revisit to verify [A] that you just did appropriately what you meant, and [B] that what you deliberate to do yesterday remains to be a legitimate and helpful defence at present.
And the thought of getting any individual that will help you assessment what’s taking place, significantly while you assume one thing unhealthy has simply occurred, is it implies that you don’t find yourself with safety incidents being main distractions to your common IT and Safety Operations group.
Distractions might really be intentionally seeded by the crooks to behave as a distraction for the assault that they’ve bought deliberate for later…
DOUG. After which lastly, we spherical ited out with a few suggestions in your employees: “Arrange a cyber safety hotline in your employees to report incidents”, and belief them that will help you out by reporting such incidents.
DUCK. Sure.
Lots of people have determined that persons are the largest downside.
I believe that’s the incorrect manner to have a look at it.
Individuals are, in reality, the most effective methods you can discover issues that you just didn’t anticipate.
It’s all the time the issues that you just didn’t anticipate that may catch you out, as a result of should you had anticipated them, you’d most likely have prevented them within the first place!
Take the aim of turning everybody in your organisation into eyes and ears in your personal safety group.
DOUG. Superb!
And we’ve bought extra Uber protection.
Paul, you and Chester Wisniewski did an ideal minisode, S3 Ep100.5.
Pure thunder, if I could.
It’s referred to as: Uber breach – An skilled speaks.
You possibly can hear Paul and Chet speaking about this specific breach in just a little bit extra depth:
DUCK. I believe an important factor that got here out of that minisode of the podcast is what you alluded to earlier, “What if this had been an Preliminary Entry Dealer?”
In different phrases, in the event that they went in particularly to get the passwords and bought out quietly.
This type of broad-but-shallow assault is definitely surprisingly widespread, and in lots of instances, as you steered, the issue is that you just don’t realise it’s occurred.
These crooks exit of their option to hold as quiet as potential, and the thought is that they take all these entry passwords, entry tokens, info they’ve bought…
…and promote it on the darkweb for different crooks who wish to do very particular issues in particular components of your community.
DOUG. All proper, we are going to keep on the breach practice, however we’re simply going to modify vehicles on the practice.
We’re going to stroll throughout and watch out to not fall out onto the platform… however we’re going to get into the LastPass automotive.
They’ve bought a publish mortem out.
They nonetheless don’t know the way the criminals bought in, however not less than they admitted it.
And it looks like it wasn’t essentially for the lulz… thus comparable however totally different to the Uber breach.
DUCK. Certainly, plainly this one, you may say, was deeper however narrower.
I believe the report is an efficient instance of learn how to present info that’s really helpful after an assault.
As you say, they appear to have come out with info that makes it clear what they assume occurred.
They admitted to the “identified unknowns”.
For instance, they stated, “It appears to be like as if the crooks implanted malware that was capable of masquerade as a developer who had already logged in with their password and 2FA code.”
They figured that out, however they don’t know the way that implant occurred within the first place, they usually have been respectable sufficient to say they didn’t know.
And I believe that’s fairly good, somewhat than simply going, “Oh, properly, we’ve undoubtedly fastened all the issues and this received’t occur once more.”
If I have been a LastPass consumer, it might make me extra inclined to consider the opposite issues that I’ve to depend on them to state…
…particularly that the event community the place their code was stolen is separate from their different networks, in order that the attackers weren’t capable of attain out and get issues like buyer information or password hashes.
And I’m additionally inclined to just accept LastPass’s clarification (as a result of they’re capable of justify it) that even when the crooks *had* been capable of leap from the developer community to the cloud storage components of the community, and even when they’d been capable of run off with password hashes, it might have been very troublesome for them to do something with it.
As a result of LastPass merely doesn’t know your grasp password.
They usually have just a little diagram that explains why they consider that to be the case.
So, I believe, if I have been a Final Go consumer, that I’d be inclined to consider them.
DOUG. I *am* a Final Go consumer, and I discovered this to be extra reassuring than not.
I wasn’t too nervous about this earlier than, and now I’m barely much less nervous, and positively not nervous sufficient to dump it wholesale, change all my passwords, and that form of stuff.
So I assumed it was fairly good.
DUCK. Certainly, one of many considerations that folks got here out with after we first reported on this breach is, “Effectively, the crooks bought into the supply code management system. In the event that they have been capable of obtain all this mental property, what in the event that they have been capable of add some sneaky and unauthorised adjustments on the identical time?”
Possibly they ran off with the code so they might promote the mental property, so industrial espionage was their main car…
…however what if there was a provide chain assault as properly?
And LastPass did try and reply that query by saying, “We’ve reviewed supply code adjustments and so far as we will see, the attackers weren’t capable of, or didn’t, make any.”
Additionally, they clarify how even when the crooks had made adjustments, there are checks and balances that forestall these adjustments simply flowing robotically into the software program that you just may obtain, or that their very own cloud providers may use.
In different phrases, they’ve a bodily separation between the developer community and the manufacturing community, and a full-and-proper code assessment and testing course of is required every time for one thing primarily to leap throughout that hole.
I discovered that reassuring.
They’ve taken precautions that make it much less probably {that a} provide chain assault within the improvement community might attain prospects.
They usually seem to have gone out of their option to confirm that no such adjustments have been made anyway.
DOUG. Alright, there’s extra on that on nakedsecurity.sophos.com, together with a hyperlink to the LastPass briefing itself.
Allow us to now flip to one in every of our listeners!
Bare Safety Podcast listener Jonas writes in…
…and that is an oldie-but-a-goodie.
I wouldn’t have believed this myself – I’ve heard this story earlier than in several contexts, and I really witnessed this as I used to be working as a pc technician again within the early 2000s.
This can be a actual downside, and it occurs.
Jonas writes:
“In within the early Nineties, our pc classroom had plenty of Apple Macintosh Classics with the three.5-inch floppy drives.
In these days, while you wanted to put in issues, you probably did so with a bunch of disks – Insert disk 1; Insert disk 2; and so forth.
Effectively, one in every of my classmates took the set up directions too actually.
She began with the primary diskette, and after some time the set up course of instructed her to ‘Please insert disk 2’, and he or she did.”
Simply let that sit there for just a little bit…
DUCK. [LAUGHS A BIT TOO LOUDLY] We shouldn’t snicker, eh?
The directions might have been clearer!
DOUG. Jonas continues:
“When retelling the story, she stated, ‘The second disk was a bit more durable to get in, however I managed to drive it in. But it surely nonetheless saved asking for the second disk.’
So she didn’t perceive why it nonetheless wanted disk 2 when she had already inserted disk 1 *and* disk 2… and it was fairly arduous to get the 2 disks out.
And even then, the floppy drive by no means labored once more on that Mac anyway.
It wanted to get replaced, however the entire class realized you wanted to take away the earlier disk earlier than inserting the subsequent one.”
DUCK. Effectively, there you’ve got it!
DOUG. I all the time bear in mind my days as a technician at CompUSA.
We had a counter.
Individuals would lug their desktop computer systems in, put the desktop up on the counter, and inform us what was incorrect.
I noticed a buyer are available and instantly noticed a diskette wedged within the 3.5-inch floppy drive, and I assumed. “Oh my God. I’ve heard this story. I’ve examine it on the web and I’m lastly experiencing it in actual life.”
It didn’t get all the best way in, however they managed to midway jam a second diskette into the floppy drive, they usually couldn’t get it out.
So we needed to open the case of the pc, disconnect and unscrew the floppy drive, pull the floppy drive out of the entrance of the pc, after which it took a few us to dislodge that diskette.
And, in fact, the disk drive had to get replaced…
Thanks very a lot, Jonas, for sending that in.
In case you have an attention-grabbing story, remark or query you’d wish to submit, we’d like to learn it on the podcast.
You possibly can electronic mail suggestions@sophos.com, you possibly can touch upon any one in every of our articles, or you possibly can hit us up on social: @NakedSecurity.
That’s our present for at present.
Thanks very a lot for listening.
For Paul Ducklin, I’m Doug Aamoth, reminding you till subsequent time to…
BOTH. Keep safe!
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